March 24, 2008
A letter from "Coopdeville" sent to our Godtube mailbox
24, 2008 at 09:54 AM
I see that you are
an ex-Mormon and consequently now an anti-Mormon. I have several
questions for you that I hope you can, in time, come to answer. I
will first start by saying that before the age of 18 I did not even
know who Jesus was, but through the grace of God I have gone through
a state of Metanoia just as the scriptures promise. I have shed away
the person and life I once lived and been given the oppertunity to
start anew in a new land with new friends and a new life. I learned
the importance of belonging to a Church as the scriptures tell us in
Ephesians chapter 4 verse 11 we see that being a lone follower is
not the way of Christianity, but in fact belonging to a Church is.
For as the scripture says ". . . He appointed some to be apostles,
others to be prophets, others to be evangelists, others to be
pastors and teachers. He did this to prepare all God's people for
the work of Christian service, in order to build up the body of
Christ. And so we shall all come together in that oneness in our
faith and in our knowledge of the Son of God. . . 16 Under His
control all the different parts of the body fit together, and the
whole body is held together by every joint with which it is
provided. So when each seperate part works as it should, the whole
body grows and builds itself up through love.
This body the
scripture speaks of is the Church, Christianity on earth as a
congregation, or family if you will. We see from these scriptures
that there is great importance to belonging to a Church. It is the
way that we are properly able to provide service and be of one mind
in our faith. However, the Bible has oblviously not proven to be
enough when it comes to keeping Christians together in the fullness,
the oneness, the BODY that we are asked to be. If it was, then we
would not have the countless Christian denominations which we do
today, all of whom claim to believe 100% of the Bible's teachings. I
am not putting down the Bible by any means, only saying that there
is more to Christianity then just reading the scriptures, just as
was true for the Jews and their scriptures. This can be seen in
Jeudaism with the teachings of the Kabalah. The fact is that every
denomination has it's different interpretations of what the Bible
teaches and it is through the lack of understanding and guidance of
the Holy Spirit that their arises so many brake off churches. I did
not find the closeness of what a Christian Church should bring
within any of the denominations I attended, only a fake attitude
among the majority of being "good christians" because they attend
church on Sundays (or Saturdays for some). I joined Catholic Church
because after studying the history of Christianity it only seemed
right that I join the original Church, the one from which, as
history states, was of the succession of the Apostles and the
Authority which was given to Saint Peter. When I was introduced to
the LDS Church I engaged in many countless arguments to prove them
wrong and after much time only came to find that it was in fact me
who was wrong. Every argument I had heard and brought to the LDS
Church was shot down with truth. I came to find that all the
anti-Mormon arguments were either based on lies, misunderstandings,
or down right lack of knowledge. If the Book of Mormon is found to
be true then so also the LDS Church must be true.
But getting back to
my questions for you I must as first where you get off saying that
those of the LDS faith are not Christians, when they Believe in the
Bible just as every other Christian does? If the interpretations of
the LDS Church are different then the Church you now attend then you
seem to think they must not be Christians, but would that not also
hold true for all the other denominations which are seperated from
yours? The attitude of referring to ANY other denominaton as being
"Not Christian" is judgmental and wrong. Look at the scripture of
LUKE 6:37 "Do not judge others and God will not judge you; Do not
condemn others and God will not condemn you. . ." LUKE 6:41 "Why do
you look at the speck in your brothers eye, but pay no attention to
the log in your own?" I do not know exactly what it is that led you
away from the LDS Church but can say that there is obvioulsy
something you must have missed in either your understanding of the
LDS teachings or in your studies of whether their happens to be
proof of the Book of Mormon's authenticity. Perhaps we would do well
in first stating why you think the LDS teachings are in opposition
or contradiction to the Bible. I know it is not but perhaps your
personal interpretations or your minister's understandings of the
Bible are different then mine, which would obviously be different
than many other Christians. Let me also say that just because there
might be some LDS teachings which are not found directly in the
Bible, does not mean that they are apposed to the Bible. Are you
aware of the Dead Sea Scrolls and how they have revealed missing
parts of Scripture that should have and were once a part of the
original Scriptures? There have been and continue to be found parts
of scripture which have been lost over the ages of time. So if the
Dead Sea Scrolls are accepted by most every denomination (this does
not mean they include it into the Bible) as being legitimate ancient
scriptures which do not appose the Bible but only add to it, then
what does it mean when the Dead Sea Scrolls actually support the
Book of Mormon and LDS teachings? If the teachings of the Kabbalah
are not found directly in the Torah then but just as important to
Jewish beliefs, then why should it be expected to differ with other
teachings of Christianity? Let me also say that the Kabbalah is
ongoing, just as certain parts of Christianity, more specifically
the LDS denomination.
Many people are
afraid of the LDS Church because of other peoples comments and
attempts at disproving their beliefs. Such things as that which is
written in Revelations 22:18 give people fear that by believing the
scriptures of the LDS Church any consideration would be of violation
to this command. However it is a misunderstanding because few seem
to know that when this was written it was referring to the book of
Revelations, not the Bible as a whole. Giving the entire scripture
of 22:18-21 serious consideration and understanding will show that
this refers to the writings of Revelations only. The Bible did not
come about until a few hundred years after the writings of John.
God’s word, which is what the Bible is, and His interactions with
His human creation do not end with the Bible, nor are they confound
to the Bible. The Jewish people know this of the Torah so why do
Christians as descendants of Jeudaism not seem to get this? The
writings and account of this only stopped when the Church fell into
apostate. The Bible gives the account of His interactions with
humans from day one (The Book of Genesis) up until the end of the
apostles. Looking to the book of Deuteronomy 4:2 we read “Ye shall
not add to the word which I am commanding you, nor shall ye diminish
ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your
God which I command you.” we see this same scripture as that which
is found in Revelations but if we took it to mean that the
scriptures should end there then we would be missing a whole lot.
That cannot even be argued. So it is with the Word of God today as
it is revealed through the Prophets and teachings of the latter
days. It is unfortinate that we have as many different denominations
as we do however it ist the humanly and earthly way of us to slip
into states of mind that are closed off, ignorant, and seperated
from our brothers and sisters. Let us not be so closed off and hard
hearted in our ways but rather open, honest, and prayerful in all
that we do as Christians so that even when there comes
disagreements, we may still view eachother as brothers in Christ. I
have much to discuss with you Hoff, but this will take much time and
we must first cover what I have stated already in this letter.
Whether you believe
it or not, we are Brothers in Christ!
March 24, 2008
Response to Coopdeville
This is a response to the above letter from
Coopdeville that he sent to our GodTube mailbox. What I hope to
share with clarity is that we often overlook the main thing and
focus on non-essentials in the religion quest. So in this
letter I point to a moment in time that is important for us to
understand with clarity before we add the machinations of men.
Did you have the opportunity to visit my website,
"New Life in Christ". Many of the concerns you
expressed are dealt with there.
You use the word Anti-Mormon very carelessly in my
opinion. I don't mind, it just simply does not apply here. I
understand why you and others us it, as I once shared a similar
mindset and mantra.
Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts
with me as it reveals that you may have a willingness to develop an
ear to hear as to discern the Word in truth.
Pilot said, “What is truth?” Jesus said, “I am the
Mormonism in my view comes across as amplified
flesh. It is built on a completely different foundation than
Christianity and its teachings are out of alignment with the Word.
One is self exaltation and the other is complete humility and
I am loyal to the Bible because the gospel message is
consistent, clear and complete, and it is truly an historical
document whereby we can visit the graves, cities and see the
evidence of the people and words written therein.
For the foreign LDS scripture, pre 1800 there is
nothing, it is purely subjective and much of it is proven to be
An example of this is the Book of Abraham. There is
a video link on the front page of my site that you can view that
shares the history of the LDS Book of Abraham.
I have heard LDS say that if you want truth about a
religion one must go to the religion itself, but I have found it to
be the least reliable source in most cases.
The LDS church led me to believe that Joseph Smith
and Emma was a happily married couple, and I heard nothing of the
sexual problems and polygamy that plagued their marriage. I am not
going to become a God, but that is what I was taught.
By looking at all sides, one is less likely to be
deceived. Eternity is a long time.
I have seen many people leave the LDS church for
genuine relationship with Jesus Christ, to become Christians. The
cost is great. But when we find that pearl of great price, as Jesus
said, would we not sell all that we have and purchase that pearl?
Jesus is that Pearl.
Men through the blinders of religiosity are beguiled
into believing all kinds of machinations of men as seen by the
examination of extra biblical history. The Bible calls us to look
to one head of the Church and to stand upon Him as our only
Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life"
...except by Him there is NO other way.
Rather than pointlessly argue the derailment of man
on his perceptions, I believe that one if desperately interested in
truth (willing to forsake all for the real thing), would do well to
examine the moment of change between the OT and the NT. Herein is
the key to understanding the freedom upon which you stand or may
stand when understood.
Bear with me on the following. Grab a pen and paper.
If you draw a cross (a line down the center and
across near the top) on a piece of paper, put a dot where the lines
intersect. At the top of the page write, "What changed?" pointing
at the dot.
On the left side top of the line write OT (Old
Testament) and also above that write LAW.
On the right side top of the line write NT (New
Covenant) and also above that write GRACE.
Now on the OT side below the line, write down the
following key words.
1 Shadow (the OT was a shadow of the real thing)
2 Prophets (Mouth peice for God prophesying the
coming of the Kingdom of Heaven and the King)
3 Priesthood of men
4 Satan had free reign
5 Penalty of Sin is death
6 The Temple was built by mans hands
7 Levitical High Priests sacrificed in Temple for
symbolic covering of sin once a year
8 Gods name not revealed, in His name ALL POWER is
9 Period of Darkness
10 God could not dwell in men- but in the Holy of
11No righteousness- righteousness of man is filthy
12 Men thought that certain works brought them closer
to God (the LAW became minute detail)
13 Animals Sacrificed persisted
14 Man is in bondage - captivity
Finally on the Right side below the line
1 Reality. Shadow was a likeness, but the reality is
2 No need for Prophets. God now dwells in us. Where
two or three are gathered, there am I said Jesus. Jesus was the
fulfillment of the words of the OT prophets.
3 Jesus became our great High Priest. (Mormonism
boasts its manhood through authority in its two manmade priesthoods
which we never saw the likes of in history, there was no such thing,
yet Joseph calls Mormonism "restored". Where is the original
4 Satan was completely conquered at the cross (he is
the father of lies and deception) Jesus gave us power and authority
5 Jesus removed the sting of death for those who
accept His free gift in truth. He paid the price for ALL sin on
earth, past, present and future.
6 We are now the Temple of God. God indwells us
today. The building built by mans hands was completely destroyed as
Jesus predicted. he needed to show that a temple built by man will
fall, and that HE WILL BUILD THE TEMPLE. We cannot do it. We are
not able. He is able.
7 Jesus became our great High Priest forever....
8 His name was revealed whereby all power is given
through the spoken word. He gave those who accept His free gift the
power and authority to speak in His Name. We have power and
authority to stand against the lies of Satan and to speak life into
the dead. We are walking dead men without the genuine reality of
Jesus Christ operating in our lives.
9 Jesus is the light. He gave us that light. That
light requires oil. Oil is relationship with Him. This is
spending time with Jesus Christ in his word, in truth. With oil our
lamps will burn brightly. If blinded by the captivity of looking to
any other source for light than Jesus Christ, our batteries will
10 God now can dwell in us. The Holy of Holies in
the Temple was an example of what it will look like when the real
thing comes. It was a shadow - parable form. The Arc represents
your innermost where the law is written, and you are dependant on
the provision of God - the manna...etc.
11 Today, Jesus is our righteousness. What pride to
think that it is possible for us to become good enough to become
equal with God to become a god...It is only in His righteousness
that we will stand on that judgment day the comes immediately after
we die on earth. Will we say, I was a Mormon or I was a Catholic or
whatever...I will say "I was a wretched sinner and deserve nothing
less than eternal hell and darkness where there is gnashing of teeth
and wailing for eternity....but I accepted the free gift at the
cross and will lay my judgment in His hands.
12 Works. Jesus said to the hardest workers of works
(the chosen ones) "You are as whited sepulchers’, all white and
beautiful on the outside, but within are full of dead mans bones"
There is no life in you.
It is not by our righteousness, but by his in and
through us. So in order for us to do this we must lay down our
lives, not to a false religion of man, but to Jesus Christ in
truth. Only then can he do the work in you.
13 The veil in the Holy of Holies in the temple was
ripped in two when Jesus died on the cross. At that moment, the
symbolic sacrifice was completely fulfilled. There was not more
need to revert back to the shadow as the reality has now come.
14 The Gospel today is the "Good News". We have been
set free from the bondage of sin and God now dwells in us because
our sin debt was paid and Jesus provided a robe to cover our foolish
nakedness. The Gospel is to share that this gift is in the
possession of everyone, they just do not know it yet. Until we
share with them in truth.
So now, why go through that little art exercise?
Mormonism comes to our doors to proclaim that they
are the only true church on earth while all others and their creeds
are an abomination...They claim that they have the "RESTORED" gospel
of Jesus Christ, that they have the priesthood authority on the
In our drawing above, what needed to be "restored"
that Jesus accomplished?
Where does our priesthood authority rest now?
Who is the Church? (Is it the one who claims to be
the only truth while all others are abominable?)
What is the ultimate significance of that transition?
If Jesus Christ (God) is the bridegroom. And we are
the bride...and he said "I DO" with his life, death and
resurrection...what now for us?
February 14, 2008
A message from My brother !
This comment was a response to my
Romney video on Godtube. I asked him to Check out my
website when he got an opportunity. I am encouraged that he
took the time to visit and to share his thoughts.
I am Eric Hoff's Brother Todd Hoff. I am the brother that actually
continued to go to church as we were growing up, went on a mission,
and continue to be active today. It makes me sad that Eric tries so
hard to get others to go away from thier faith, rather than just
promoting Christ. He has seached both church history books & Anti
Morman materials to bring you his interprotations of whether Mormons
are Christians or not. I belong to The Church of Jesus Christ of
Latter day saints (mormon). I learn of Christ when I go to church,
when I read bible & book of mormon, and when I pray in the name of
Jesus Christ. I know that he died for my sins, because I am not
perfedt. Christ is our example and I strive to be like him. When I
fall short he makes up the difference. I love my brother Eric Hoff,
I wish him the best in his ednevours , but his view of mormanism is
very distorted. Just ask your morman neighbors, friends , and work
associates who actually go to church and strive to live its
teachings. They will likely tell you that they learn about the
gospel of Jesus Christ and that the church is only a means to spread
his gospel and conduct priesthood ordinances with the authority of
Christ such as baptism. Also where 2 or more are gathered in his
name, there he will be also. If Eric has fouind what he believes is
a better path to Christ or whatever he does believy in, then he has
the right to do so and I love him and wish him well. I maintain
however, that we should share what we bellieve is true to those who
are willing to hear it, but not tear down others faith. Everyione
has the right to believe in whatever faith they choose, and we do
not have the right to take that away from them. I am happy in my
faith and I wish Eric would leave me alone regarding faith. It makes
me sad that as clear as I have made this to him that he continues to
direct me to websites, videos, or books trying to change my mind so
that I might give up my faith. If someone has a desire to leave the
Mormon faith and is not happy with it, then by all means help that
person find an alternate path to Christ or God of thier choosing if
thats what they are seeking. But dont try to pull others from their
faith or go back into church records till you find something that
you can use to show the public a distorted view. If someone wants to
learn about the Mormon, Jewish, Isam, Hindo, Butta, Catholic, etc
.... faith then go to one of thier representavies or faci!@#!ies and
learn about it directly. Not from someone who wasn't able to live
its teachings and was unhappy and has somehow become bitter. Romeny
has as much right to run for President as someone from any other
faith. To attack him because of his faith is simply wrong. I believe
it is more important to judge someone by whether they actually live
their faith rather than whatever faith it happens to be. Being
active in the Mormon faith is not easy, it requires you to give
allot of your time to others, and is very strict concerning alchohal,
drugs, smoking, morality, and other things that can sometimes be
extreemly hard to follow. Its ministry is unpaid and called through
revelation rather than a college degree. When its members fall short
of the teachings (and they will because we cant be perfect in this
life) there is a means to make it better with God. It's called
repentance and the gospel teaches us that throuh Christ we can be
washed clean and try again. We renew this process each time we take
the sacriment each Sunday which reminds us that Christ is there for
us when we fall short. It is simply not fair that Eric can say that
I am not a Christian while I attend the morman church. Christ is the
center of my daily life. May God Bless you all what ever your faith
might be ;)
February 16th, 2008
My Brother Todd, How are you? I cannot wait for the
opportunity to come and visit you and your sweetheart.
Thank you for visiting my website and coming here to
share your thoughts. That 5 star rating ran far too long anyway,
thanks for the new rating! Moreover I am glad to see you here, and
glad that you responded. It shows that you care. It has been a
great deal of time since we have touched this subject.
As you have noticed, I do not accept Mormonism to be
Christianity nor Christianity to be Mormonism. It is just not
possible to intertwine the two. We MUST understand the foundation
upon which each is built. Only then can we build on the genuine
I can understand how emotional things can be from the
LDS mindset, to see your brother so adamant about clarifying
something that you have poured your entire life into...You must know
that I am not the enemy, I represent the king.
I demolished my house which was built upon the old
LDS foundation and I built a new home upon Jesus Christ alone.
I believe that anyone can become a Christian at any
time, but we must renounce any counterfeit, we must renounce the
hidden things of dishonesty, we must renounce sin.
Why do I extend my hand to reach out to LDS?
I have a heart for them, I know both sides. I left
Mormonism to become a Christian according to the Bible. I
understand the LDS dilemma.
You see the Bible tells us that we die, then the
Judgment. LDS actually believe that they can continue to progress
after this life to achieve their salvation and exaltation eventually
to become a god, as in the 3rd degree of the celestial kingdom and
plan of salvation.
LDS claim to be the restored gospel, the true
church. But when we examine these foundational claims neither is
true. If restored, where is the original model? A brief review of
the history of the LDS church reveals that the flesh is central to
LDS doctrine and the doctrine changes and shifts as the wind. (LDS
call it modern revelation).
Having two adopted black daughters I consider the LDS
teaching and doctrine that blacks could not attain salvation from
Cain to 1978 simply abhorrent. I do not accept blood atonement
(that the blood of Jesus is not sufficient), I do not accept the
teachings of the LDS prophets and neither do most Mormons. LDS call
some of the statements of LDS Prophets Anti-Mormon material. I
will not become a God, the teachings are problematic. I do not
believe in a plurality of Gods nor the plurality of wives. My
salvation does not hinge on the LDS church, tithing to it, LDS
foreign to the Bible priesthood, polygamy, Joseph Smith,
contradictory scripture, or any such thing as taught by Mormon
Yes many LDS people are nice people. There are a lot
of nice people. It is good to be nice. I think the enemy prays on
those who genuinely would want to know god and gets them into
contract knowing that it would be difficult for them to break a
contract because of their desire to choose the right. If the enemy
can get us to see a counterfeit as good, many out of lack of
knowledge may fall pray to it.
We are called to walk in truth, according to the Word
of God, to represent Jesus Christ according to His Word, the Bible.
An examination of LDS teaching and additional
scripture reveals major problems, problems that the Christian
community simply cannot accept. Mormonism contradicts Christianity
and the Bible. There is no evidence to support the claims of the
BoM. No history, no archeological support, no cities, no graves,
nothing. A big void.
Most importantly, What Jesus Christ accomplished at
the transition between the OT and the NT was on the other hand a
very big deal. Of these accomplishments, what needed to be
restored? Jesus showed us that it is in, through and of Him, not of
men. Him alone. That is why the temple built with mans hands was
destroyed! He rebuilt it! We are the temple now, our bodies!
Jesus is in us according to the Bible.
Mormons are building foreign temples, performing
proxy works for the dead, and covenanting with their god(s) in these
non Biblical buildings.
Todd there is no better path, there is only one
path. Jesus Christ said, I am the way, the truth and the life,
except by me no one will enter. This path is the one that I point
to as I lead people in the direction of truth.
You wrote a common LDS mantra, tear down others
faith. You said that I am somehow bitter. Regarding Romney, you
viewed my video as attack because his faith is wrong. These are
descriptives that I recognize often and that we were taught as we
grew up and were instructed by LDS thought, ensign, conference
talks, seminary etc…They are empty words. They are fear based.
Your perception of attacking Romney tells me that you
did not watch the video. Romney said that we worship the same God,
that we regard neither race nor creed etc. Bottom line, We as
Christians in this country, do not worship the same LDS God(s) and
LDS are knocking on our Bible believing doors to tell us that our
belief and creeds are an abomination to God and that we should join
the only true church then try to call it Christianity. His speech in
my view was not true.
As a Christian I cannot just sit by and say nothing.
I love Mormons, I am not interested in tearing down other peoples
faiths, but do hope that some will develop an ear to hear, a
willingness to be teachable as to be able to look at all sides
before making the decision for eternity. We are judged when we
die. This is the place to come to the knowledge of who we are in
truth, who we are in Christ. This is the day.
Webb17 Jan 22, 2008
The teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ and
Christians are anything but opposites. The most important doctrine
that is teached is that salvation is only attainable through Christ
and that is the only way. Mormons read out of the bible just the
same as christians do although they might interpret some things
Hi Webb, Jan 23, 2008
Having left Mormonism after nearly 30+ years for a
genuine relationship in Jesus Christ according to the Holy Bible, I
completely understand both sides. With confidence I can say that
Mormonism and Christianity are opposites. When one develops a
willingness to examine the foundations of each, he then can see with
clarity, the truth.
The subjective approach will not cut it in the end.
(Truth, history and ideas determined based on 'feeling' as
evidence). This is the 'still small voice' -often called the
burning in the bosom by LDS.
When Christians come forward and defend their faith
based on a reality backed by real facts (archeological, historical
and scriptural evidence and support), LDS often view this as
an 'attack'. LDS Bob Millet warns young Mormons that they will be
attacked because of their faith and teaches that this somehow strengthens
the LDS logic (truth of the subjective) labeling it loud jangling.
Still small voice = LDS truth (really means no
Loud Jangling = LDS proof of truth (really means
someone is pointing out lack of evidence)
Christianity is built upon a foundation of Jesus
Christ according to the Bible.
LDS build upon a foundation of alien priesthood and
temple, polytheism, polygamy, racism, conflicting scripture, false
history, false translation (the BoA), another gospel and baptism,
plan of salvation via works, proxy works for dead, covenants, oaths,
goal to become eternally procreating Gods, modern prophets, God and
Jesus have bodies, work accomplished for salvation after this life
(Bible tells us that : we die then judgment), teach that Gods love,
word, truth, and work on the cross were somehow lost and needed to
be restored and this only scratches the surface.
If we with an open mind (ears to hear as Jesus said)
examine the words and teachings of the LDS Prophets and leaders, we
will soon see that the salvation in the LDS Church is literally
IMPOSSIBLE. Generally the response to this is to ignore it and
‘feel’ that one is being attacked, and go on blissfully still
thinking Mormonism is somehow Christian...
An LDS person can in fact accept Jesus Christ as
their savior, and become a Christian in truth. This will eventually
enable them to see that the corporate system of Mormonism is not it.
And Jesus will lead them out.
I give my time in this effort, for you, out of
understanding and love for you, I have seen many come out and come
to Jesus Christ in truth, because of my experience; I developed a
heart to share the truth in love to the LDS.
Jesus is sufficient.
Eric - looks really, really good; very
informative and, as always, very gentle in the approach.